American soldier kills 16 civilians in Afghanistan

[Ikku]

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/03/12/world ... ml?_r=1&hp

[kandy green]

what is wrong? it is so cruel. but I want to know why are they killed?

[weedguru_animal]

they are killed because the US army recruits more fucked up down and outs, regardless of their psychological make-up and obvious reasons for signing up, then gives them a gun, and sends them to war against people who have done them no harm...this is hardly an isolated incident. Recruit a gang of retarded, vicious cunts, and let them run amok...Obama then suggests that such an incident doesnt reflect on the rest of the US forces fighting abroad for the gain of Cunts they know nothing about...Its McDonalds politics. But yet, so many continue to wave the flag still proud and loud. The guy who did this should have everyone he loves tortured then killed in front of him, then handed over to Al-shabab for many days of target practice with their stones...before a very slow beheading. I am 100% FOR an eye for an eye when no trial is needed to determine culpability. Kill him and focus intensely on his bloodline, and cull all associated by crimson rivers whenever such clearly evil behaviour suggests itself...

[Weedguru_Fire_Inside]

I'm just not surprised by this kind of shit anymore....

[SToNeR ChRiS]

they are killed because the US army recruits more fucked up down and outs, regardless of their psychological make-up and obvious reasons for signing up, then gives them a gun, and sends them to war against people who have done them no harm...this is hardly an isolated incident. Recruit a gang of retarded, vicious cunts, and let them run amok...Obama then suggests that such an incident doesnt reflect on the rest of the US forces fighting abroad for the gain of Cunts they know nothing about...Its McDonalds politics. But yet, so many continue to wave the flag still proud and loud. The guy who did this should have everyone he loves tortured then killed in front of him, then handed over to Al-shabab for many days of target practice with their stones...before a very slow beheading. I am 100% FOR an eye for an eye when no trial is needed to determine culpability. Kill him and focus intensely on his bloodline, and cull all associated by crimson rivers whenever such clearly evil behaviour suggests itself...

I refuse to get into any type of political debate on the matter because I have read everything there is to read on the topic throughout my years on this site... But this type of thing has been going on since the first ever battle between the ancient Sumerians and Elamians. Do you truly believe that when the Spartans or Vikings went into combat with other societies, they cared for civilians and only attacked those who had weapons? No, they simply raped, pillaged and destroyed whoever and whatever they came across. I could name a hundred other civilizations who did the same. This is in no way a statement to condone what this officer has done but is it only because we live in a "morally right" civilization based on technology and media that the USA needs to be demonized in such a fashion? They are no worse than any other militaristic superpower this planet has ever seen. Not to mention there are countless other nations in modern day society who do even worse things than the United States, so why are they so often singled out? No reason to be in Afghanistan? I understand our political views are different from one another but there certainly are warlords and terrorist groups within Afghani borders who's SPECIFIC aim are to cause damage and harm to westernized nations. I will not argue that there are, in some instances, alterior motives as well but there are certainly legitimate reasons to be there in the first place.

As far as I'm concerned there are always two sides to the coin, and if it is indeed true that terrorist groups from Afghanistan have "done no harm" to the US (since September 11th) as you have pointed out, then the presence of the US army has done an effective job in their preventative measures. Should they have done harm to the US it would be too late, no?

As for the psychological makeup of an individual, you can have the most sane person break down as a consequence of situational instances that no one could have prepared for. I consider myself psychologically fit and still, it would not surprise me in the very least if I had a mental breakdown if I went to war (god forbid). This is a point I will argue less though because I do understand where you are coming from... It seems as though the USA will recruit anyone and everyone. If people can't find a job even at McDonalds, they will turn to the army... and more often than not they will be admitted. Perhaps the same can be said for other nations as well though?

I am not American and I can understand the international viewpoint of the United States because recently my father and I have moved here and even he dislikes the way they operate towards and treat even their OWN people. But the incessant name calling and portrayal of them being a greater evil than they truly are is needless in my opinion.

This incident is still shocking and appalling though, there's no debate about that.

[JokersAce]

I am not American and I can understand the international viewpoint of the United States because recently my father and I have moved here and even he dislikes the way they operate towards and treat even their OWN people.

elaboration requestzrd

[SToNeR ChRiS]

Well first of all, my nationality is Canadian so I didn't want to make it seem like I'm simply a massively patriotic American trying to defend my nation... though I am a US resident and love it here.

As for the second point, I personally am a very open minded person so I do not necessarily have the same viewpoint as my father (as a matter of fact I don't) but he has a little more trouble adapting. I wouldn't say there is anything major but take for instance sporting events... Before you are even allowed to enter, you always have to empty your pockets, go through a metal detector etc... It's not that big of a deal but in many places in the world something like that would be unheard of. This is only one example and I understand that there probably are other places in the world that do similar things when it comes to security checks but the way it's carried out in America is simply unique. I'm also sure there are other examples of the point I'm trying to make. So imagine, say, an eastern European coming to America and experiencing this for the first time... Obviously they would have a tainted impression of how America really isn't "free" and is extremely strict even towards their own people. There's almost this "guilty before proven innocent" mentality. Once again I'm not saying that I agree with the international mentality but what I stated is that I can understand it.

As I said though, the subtle differences don't bother me whatsoever but to people who already have a skewed perception of the United States, this only adds fuel to the fire. The point that I could try to make is that the way the US carries out their foreign policy in the army is actually quite similar to the manner in which security and police treat the people of their own nation... In the end people can complain about it all they want but the negative aspects are actually blown out of proportion in my own opinion. There are certainly bad people in the army and the police who do horrendous things (just like ANY other nation), but the vast majority truly want to serve for a positive cause...

[Weedguru_Fire_Inside]

I disagree wholeheartedly Dan. This man should be killed, but his family should be nothing to do with it. That is a sick and twisted idea, indeed.

And Chris, America are singled out because, although they are not completely alone in their actions, they are the biggest warlords in existence. They are invasive of other countries, having little to no respect for the lands they do invade (eg. did you see what the jarhead, redneck fuckers did to the gardens of babylon?) Granted, not their entire armed forces are to blame, but it is a certain proportion of American soldiers alone who are to blame, and that is why they are singled out, in my opinion. I can only think of 1 reason why, over the last 10 years or so, america have been shone in the negative spotlight and that is because they have been involved in pretty much every war. They are invaders. If they don't have a valid reason to invade, they will make sure one is created in good time.

And with all due respect, are they actually singled out? I've seen more in the news about this fucking Joseph Kony character recently.

However, in actuality the nationality of the killer is irrelevant to me. When all is said and done, we're all human and those actions would have been just as despicable if any other person had committed them.

[SToNeR ChRiS]

I completely agree with everything you said there AFI. But part of the problem I have is that in the minds of many, the USA is actually compared with a TRUE evil like Kony. Admittedly the US have done some fucked up things in their time but I can't fully turn my head away from the possibility that certain countries truly would have done greater harm to other Western nations without some of the preventive measures which the United States have undertaken. Much of my theory is surely hypothetical but I do believe the line is somewhere between both extreme perspectives.

I'm sure many middle eastern countries would disagree with my point of view but from my own perspective there are many other countries out there who would be much worse superpower warlords than the United States. Once you are at the top, it is an unfortunate reality that power will be abused... It's just a matter of to what extent.

[Weedguru_Fire_Inside]

Your view, in that respect, is certainly hypothetical, but it is a view which must be considered, nonetheless. I agree that the threat (as far as I can tell from the media) is definitely out there and measures must be taken to neutralise it, but I think its been sensationalized beyond belief. So much so, in fact, that many people associate any persons of middle eastern descent with terrorism.

And I agree. The US are at least trying to make it look as if they are at war for the greater good, whereas Joseph Kony goes around slaughtering innocent people with no regard for their lives or how their killings will be viewed by anybody else. There is more good to come out of the US "interventions" than comes from Joseph Konys' rampages.

[J O E]

high score

[hemi49er]

Too much war, for too long. This is a tragic event that has no solution other than to stop the warring and bring our soldiers home. Can you imagine a world where the US minds our own business and let's each nation care for itself? How about a 10 year global truce - no war, and no aid. We spend 10 years cleaning up our debt, building a society that is realigned with 21st century values? Ok, off my soap box. War sucks.

[JokersAce]

I agree with that, but if your definition of realigning our values to the 21st century equates to strictly following an 18th century document... then count me out.

[sugarstalker]

when it comes to US (Western) intervention, I am torn, because there are a lot of places where I, as a westerner, consider our ethics, and norms as more.... ethical. but at the same time, should we really be forcing our way of living on others? I dunno.

[lilscrappy]

woahhh what a sad story
the 16 civillians Afghanistanian peoples
are killed...
whoa... i dont like it..